Following the latest bombings in Mogadishu, which has left at least 281 dead, and many hundreds injured, Somalis in the diaspora i.e. those who have got some western government to accept them, are up in arms at protest.
.... not at the bombers, oh no, but at westerners for not hash tagging 'Je Suis Mogadishu', or some such sentiment, for not making it a trending hash tag.
They went to the social media platforms to vent their anger at us ....
'If what happened in #Mogadishu had happened in Milan or Milwaukee or Middlesbrough we wouldn't still be talking about Harvey Weinstein.' commented one. 'Mogadishu blast is not even trending..Africa u are on ur own..' said another. Most comments followed these lines .... 'Poor brown folks who live in a country that doesn't offer anything to western countries are worthless to the eyes of media. #IAmMogadishu'
Khaled Beydoun a professor of Law in Detroit, said that "There are no slogans claiming 'we are Mogadishu' and no catchy images floating around social media demonstrating solidarity." This was echoed by Muslim news media such as Aljazeera ....
.... But what these people forget is that Somalia's problems are almost entirely of their own making .... they got rid of their last legitimate government decades ago (in 1991), and in the Somali Civil War which broke out when they immediately partitioned their own country into many bits, mostly controlled by various criminal and mafia warlords or Jihadists groups.
Any attempt to help them out this mess has been rebuffed by violence (see Black hawk Down), and they seem content enough to keep the country broken, and have no taxes and no central government. In the meantime its Somali pirates who hijacks ships, kill crews and demand ransoms. Its Somali raiders who cross into neighbouring states and kill or take hostages .... Ask Kenya who it is who attacks their country.
So why should many people in the West care, if once again some despicable group or other kills and maims in Somalia .... we are largely just happy that in this instance its not over here. If these Internet warriors, safe in their western refuges really want to support Somalia, they should go home and back a peaceful transition to a representative government, and not worry about how many hash tags followers they can garner.
Somalia's people inflicted the wounds on their own country .... in this regard they were the role model for the Syrians who marched for 'peace', and only brought in the Islamist terror groups who have destroyed their country. Islam is a religion with violence in its DNA, and so to pretend that its somehow the non Muslim West's fault is faintly ridiculous.
By all means they can vilify us for not hash-tagging the latest outrage if it makes it easier on their consciences, but they should never forget who brought Somalia to its current state 30 years ago .... it was them or their parents.
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| Somali Bombings Are All Too Common .... |
.... not at the bombers, oh no, but at westerners for not hash tagging 'Je Suis Mogadishu', or some such sentiment, for not making it a trending hash tag.
They went to the social media platforms to vent their anger at us ....
'If what happened in #Mogadishu had happened in Milan or Milwaukee or Middlesbrough we wouldn't still be talking about Harvey Weinstein.' commented one. 'Mogadishu blast is not even trending..Africa u are on ur own..' said another. Most comments followed these lines .... 'Poor brown folks who live in a country that doesn't offer anything to western countries are worthless to the eyes of media. #IAmMogadishu'
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| Call To Pray For Mogadishu Falls On Deaf Ears According To Activists ....... |
Khaled Beydoun a professor of Law in Detroit, said that "There are no slogans claiming 'we are Mogadishu' and no catchy images floating around social media demonstrating solidarity." This was echoed by Muslim news media such as Aljazeera ....
.... But what these people forget is that Somalia's problems are almost entirely of their own making .... they got rid of their last legitimate government decades ago (in 1991), and in the Somali Civil War which broke out when they immediately partitioned their own country into many bits, mostly controlled by various criminal and mafia warlords or Jihadists groups.
Any attempt to help them out this mess has been rebuffed by violence (see Black hawk Down), and they seem content enough to keep the country broken, and have no taxes and no central government. In the meantime its Somali pirates who hijacks ships, kill crews and demand ransoms. Its Somali raiders who cross into neighbouring states and kill or take hostages .... Ask Kenya who it is who attacks their country.
So why should many people in the West care, if once again some despicable group or other kills and maims in Somalia .... we are largely just happy that in this instance its not over here. If these Internet warriors, safe in their western refuges really want to support Somalia, they should go home and back a peaceful transition to a representative government, and not worry about how many hash tags followers they can garner.
Somalia's people inflicted the wounds on their own country .... in this regard they were the role model for the Syrians who marched for 'peace', and only brought in the Islamist terror groups who have destroyed their country. Islam is a religion with violence in its DNA, and so to pretend that its somehow the non Muslim West's fault is faintly ridiculous.
By all means they can vilify us for not hash-tagging the latest outrage if it makes it easier on their consciences, but they should never forget who brought Somalia to its current state 30 years ago .... it was them or their parents.
I can understand your point of view from a national perspective, but when you're an innocent Somalian who's not political, and just wants a quiet life, I sympathise. I was born into a democracy and I've not had to fight for a comfortable, hassle free life. I don't know what my part of the blame would be if I were born in Somalia - I might even be a Muslim!
ReplyDeleteBeing born into a democratic society is probably why you are safe to not be a Muslim. Name me one democratic Muslim state? Turkey? .... don't make laugh .. president for life and elected autocratic president Erdogan has subsumed democracy in Turkey. Malaysia? They regularly pass laws to penalise the Hindus and Christians. After that who? Islamic societies are often violent societies with no rule of law and their inhabitants subject to arbitrary 'justice', and that's why the majority live in places barely better than Somalia. None of their governments have liberal laws or a judiciary who are free of political interference. .. just look at the UAE, where the sheikh can over rule the courts because a case damaged tourism because they were applying Islamic decency laws. Justice is similarly served in Turkey, Somalia and many other Islamic states .... comfortable lives in those regimes means having no involvement in politics other than voting for the regime, no run ins with courts, and paying your bribes on time.
DeleteThe Somalis have, whether willingly or not at an individual level, acquiesced to the thugs running the state .... another set of bombings have taken place since this post was written. Just reinforces my view of the cause.
'#IAmMogadishu' indeed.
That's just what I was saying, if I was born in Somalia I would be a Muslim, but I wasn't so I had the liberty to choose. You're being too harsh on those who didn't have the good fortune to be born in a democracy. Imagine if you were born in Somalia 30 years ago, do you think that Somalia would be any different today thanks to your free thinking or might you be one of today's Somalis doing whatever it is that today's Somalis are doing ?
DeleteHmm, so being born into a democracy is (or was until the last 30 years), largely synonymous with being a non Muslim and therefore experiencing good fortune, and that you lived in liberty. While being born into a non democracy meant you had a high chance of being Muslim and therefore having no liberty.
DeleteSo in summary:
Non Muslim = Liberty = Democracy.
Muslim = No Liberty = No Democracy
Therefore Somalia being 100% Muslim means that having no liberty is the natural state and therefore no democracy is the result?
My free thinking is because I am not a Muslim which suggests that my point about why Somalia is in the mess its in is valid. Islamic societies are often violent societies, with no rule of law, and their inhabitants subject to arbitrary 'justice'. al-Shabab are a Somali born Islamic terrorist group but hardly unique to that country, region or religion.
Somalia's lawless state, is not even unique amongst Muslim states with Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan in very similar states of near anarchy. The rest of the Muslim majority states are to varying degrees similarly lacking in liberty e.g Pakistan has a politicised judiciary, blasphemy laws against non Muslims or 'free thinkers' like a Vroomfondel, so does Saudi Arabia. The UAE has arbitrary justice that the sheikh applies as suits him. I repeat, the root causes of all these issues are the commonality they share ... the religion of peace.
Oh and you might want to consider Womens freedoms in those very same societies. Non existent and with sexual violence the normal state of affairs .... In 2013 a UN report said that 99% of the women it surveyed in Egypt had been sexually harassed. A recent poll suggests that Cairo is the world's most dangerous megacity for women.
DeleteMy comment was not contradicting yours, I am pointing out that on an individual level you don't have much choice and that we could sympathise with someone born into such a society and be thankful that we were not.
DeleteAs a country, perhaps it's not too harsh to say it's their own fault, but I'm not sure that it's fair to say that to an individual.
In the same way, we can't take credit for our free, democratic societies individually. They are the product of many people and circumstances over a long period of time.
DeleteOf course we can take credit for our societies. They are a development unique to Western Europe and where its planted its peoples: Western and now Central Europe, USA, Canada, Australasia, and to a lesser extent South America.
DeleteThe democratic model, with its capitalistic and socialist parties accepting the results of free elections has been picked up by some other societies such as Japan and South Korea and a few others, who otherwise would still have been ruled by Emperors, Shoguns, Kings, Warlords, Dictators, Single Party's etc. Without our inherent willingness to evolve from the rule of Kings to the rule of law (and after all we tried it repeatedly from the Greeks onward until it stuck ... even the Romans believed the law applied to Emperors as well as citizens), I doubt anyone else would have tried it. However it was brave individuals in our societies who drove through the enlightenment, not society itself.
Groups of individuals in many societies could make a difference, but somehow in Africa and the Middle-East they don't. In the case of Muslim states the ignorance from the mosques seems to always drag their societies back to the 7th century ... Women have 'quarter of brain' says Saudi cleric ... despite social media outpourings in these countries (hiding safely behind screen names), its clerics like this who can whip up a mob against anyone who is identified as a free thinker.
Until individuals who want change band together and tackle the clerics powers, Islamic societies will remain in thrall to the rule of the violent and the backward.
Yes, WE (including our predecessors) can take credit for our societies, but I cannot.
DeleteIt's difficult to admit that we are not in total control of our own lives, that if things had been a bit different we might be living different lives and holding different views.
It's arguable that even WE can claim credit;
Greece is the cradle of Democracy because of :
1. Climate
2. Geography
3. Language
4. The emergence of logical intelligence
These are lucky circumstances not controlled by the Greeks. They are credited with the invention but they did not make it happen in a circumstantial vacuum.
"Greece is the cradle of Democracy" is a link above.
DeleteWhy do your links show up an mine don't?
There are links in both posts?
DeleteAnyway to pick up a point:
1. Climate
2. Geography
3. Language
4. The emergence of logical intelligence
Depending upon your definition of your 4 points : Egypt had all these things. The Carthaginian's as well. Phonecia and the Assyrians and the Babylonians also had them .... so why not them as well?
I think that your reasoning is either highly selective or not sustainable. Either these lucky happen-stance's should always evolve a European type of liberty and culture or there was something more involved.
I also think that you are simply missing the point, that whilst I individually can't claim credit for the enlightenment and all that developed from it, certain individuals made these things happen. Individuals can therefore affect the society that they live in and groups of individuals even more so.
An example is Thomas Paine, who influenced the the American colonists into rebellion. Later he was involved in the French Revolution and influenced the development of English political direction. His work the Rights of Man, posits that popular political revolution is permissible when a government does not safeguard the natural rights of its people. That one man changed the history of the world. or how about Karl Marx, his ideas caused the death of many millions and still echoes in China.
As usual Vroomfondel old chap we have reached something of an intellectual impasse. Your position seems to that individuals can't determine their society it's a collective thing determined by the factors you listed. whilst my view is that individuals can change societies that are open to change by their nature. Some such as Islamic cultures are ill equipped for change through their nature, and can be catapulted back into the early middle ages by a few bearded men and a collective willingness to go there.
Ah well, I leave you right of reply as usual ..... cheers NoPC
This comment has been removed by the author.
DeleteLink : http://www.solonsynthesis.org/index.php/democracy-totalitarianism/21-democracy-totalitarianism/265-why-greece-became-the-cradle-of-the-democracy.html
Delete- where you'll find the definition of the four points.
To say that Egypt, the Carthaginian's, etc. had all these things is like asking why Britain isn't a major producer of oranges, or why Ireland doesn't have the same granite as Italy. Climate and geography are very specific throughout the World and shape the biology that lives there, just ask Darwin.
Not an intellectual impasse but a misunderstanding, I obviously am bad at stating my position.
It's not that individuals can't determine their society - they can and they do - it's that an individual can't take responsibility for the society into which (s)he was born or in which (s)he lives and so warrants some sympathy for their plight.
If Thomas Paine was born in Somalia 30 years ago it would look no different today, in fact one can imagine that there have been Thomas Paines and Albert Einsteins born in Somalia at some point and the conditions were not right for them to realise their potential or make a dent. If they weren't murdered for their free thinking, they kept their heads down to stay alive. As you say Islamic cultures are ill equipped for change - what do you expect an individual to do today in Somalia to make a difference? - by him/herself, on their own, as an individual.
Thomas Paine influenced the American colonists into rebellion because he was able to, the conditions were right - what effect would he have today in an Islamic country?
"and a collective willingness to go there" Why not "an individual's willingness to go there"?
There are reasons why some societies went through the Enlightenment and others got stuck with Islam and went backwards as a result, all of which are out of the control of the individual - groups of individuals over long periods of time ARE responsible but it's not fair or just to say to a Somalis today "it's your own fault".